Simon Sinek
episode 41
Simon Sinek is an inspiring young author who has risen to fame on the back of a famous TED talk that explained the inspiration behind Apple. Now he's written NY Times bestsellers and spends his day traveling the world and inspiring leaders.
Tune in to his ideas for inspiring others and the biggest question of them all - 'Why?'.
INTRO
Definition Of Innovation - Purpose
A BLOCK - Lifehacking
How to Find Fulfilment at Work (Why idea)
Understanding Courage
Simon Sinek on Intensity vs Consistency
Stop being Nervous vs. Excited
How to Identify Your Passion and Create Results From It
Chad Book Review:
Leaders Eat Last: Why Some Teams Pull Together and Others Don't
Start with Why: How Great Leaders Inspire Everyone to Take Action
B BLOCK - Leadership
Learn to Lead
How to Establish Trust When Building Relationships
Managing by Turning Followers into Leaders
Why You Should Always Be the Last to Speak
TRANSCRIPT
Hello, and welcome to dementia. It's podcast. It's episode 41. I'm your cohost Mike Parsons. And as always. I'm joined by the man from Brooklyn. Yes. Mr. Chad Owen. Good morning, Brooklyn. Good evening. Sydney and boy, Chad Owen. I thought I was busy, but it sounds like you have been traversing the United States of America here, there, and everywhere what's been going on.
Oh. You know, and just, uh, Visiting all of my clients on the West coast. I'm fortunate enough to work with some really great companies out there by here. You're going on a European tour here too. Yes. The fun never stops. We got things cooking away here in Sydney. Uh, thankfully the rugby season is over, so I'm just like immersed in work at the moment.
I got a big book arrest, Amsterdam tour coming up and to see the QualityNet team, we get to see the gradient team. It's going to be so much fun. Lots of talks. Lots of. Innovation masterclasses. It's pretty pretty action bags. Cause I've been working in the keynote chat all week, just getting everything ready.
And I think you have got to drop on our audience, uh, a very special show we've got coming up. I am super pumped for this one. Yeah. So probably one of the things that you do on all of your various travels is, is Luxembourg. Some books around it's partly, you know, some of the inspiration for this authors series.
But I actually discovered this person via some YouTube clips of some talks that he had given. And so if you haven't checked out Simon Sineck and some of the Ted talks and 99 U talks that he has given that is who we are going to be unpacking and breaking down and learning from on today's show. Yeah. Do you remember when you first came across that really famous talk he gave on.
The power of why and how we applied it to Apple. Do you remember seeing that one for the first time? Yeah. And the budding a marketer in me really, really enjoyed that because I think, yeah, just the power of the question of why, uh, is so immense and I think he was able to directly relate it to business in a way that I hadn't necessarily seen, uh, done before.
Yeah, I think we can't overstate the influence of his first major book. Start with why and how it, I mean, everyone in the marketing communications and consultancy world just was like, we're using this framework because it's just so good. I am simple and so powerful. And we're going to get into that in this show.
And this guy, Simon Sinek is so perfectly, we're very fortunate. We've got a ton of good. Uh, clips of him speaking, and we're going to be able to unpack and decode what he's talking about, work out how we can apply it. And the other critical thing here that I really want to stress is Chad. We're not only going to be delving into the world of the start with why book, but he also wrote an amazing book called leaders eat last.
And I found both books. I'm going to have to say both books would be in my top 10 business books. I don't know. How, what, what are you feeling? Did you get a chance to peruse leaders eat last? I did. Yeah. That's actually an interesting question. I would have to go back through and see all the books I've read and try to rank them.
I don't, yeah. I don't know that I have maybe quite a formulated a ranking of my books yet, but, so that might be an interesting exercise this winter. Mm, definitely. And obviously, uh, we chose Simon's today cause he's very different too. Clay Christiansen. Who's very cerebral, probably a dash of the academic pay.
Drucker is just like he defined management. If you will, Simon Sinek. I feel like what he does. So particularly well, and he really matters is he's really tuned into the behaviors that we have not only at working in life. And I find him one of the best storytellers we've ever studied on the show. Don't you Chan?
Yeah. He opens all of his talks with a really. Gripping amazing stories. Like I actually don't ever really remember the names of the talks or even necessarily sometimes like the book or something that he's referencing, but his, the opening stories that he tells are super memorable. Like I noticed like specifically the story he tells and in front of the leaders eat last presentations or keynotes that he gives is, you know, around this, um, This eight, 10 wart hog air force plan.
That's in support of troops in Afghanistan. It's just, yeah. I mean, it's just the way as you were saying, the way he kind of relates it to our personal and human experience is an, is, is a very nice contrast to the previous authors that we've been doing in this series. And he's like, he's a bit of a provocateur too.
Like he's. In this first clip that we have to kind of introduce him, you know, he's, he is not just taking things at face value and he's kind of asking us to question a few things. Yeah, absolutely. Why don't you just let it rip. This is a Simon Sinek and what we're going to hear from him is, you know, his thoughts on what really is innovation.
How are you defining innovation? Well, I mean, a definition I like is the application of technology to solve human problems. Um, I know that not all innovation is about technology. I know that, um, but I like that if we have a very broad definition of, of innovation, why does that register so well with you?
Because the important part to me is the solving of human problems. Um, just because we can do something doesn't mean we should do something. And I think, especially in the technology world, we become obsessed with the fact that we can, not that we should. Um, and we call innovation where it's really nonsense.
I mean, for example, um, do you remember when, and if you wanted to watch, um, you needed to project, or you used to pull the string down to get the screen down, like. What problem are they solving, getting rid of the string. You know, now everything has a button and by the way, those buttons and those motors break all the time.
I don't ever recall that string being a problem. And yet we feel the need because we can put motors and buttons on things that we should put a motor and button on that it's like, you look at a Toyota Prius and everything is touchscreen. So if you're following the GPS and the phone rings, you lose the GPS.
Or if you want to change the temperature. You know, or if you want to, you have to hit four screens to track what happened with knobs and buttons. Like what's wrong with turning up the volume like this for your radio? Like what human problems, where are we solving the answers? We're not solving any human problems.
That's the problem with that kind of technology? It's pointless. One of the best pieces of innovation I've seen lately is my toaster, which is, um, and I bought my toaster specifically for this feature, which is you push the toaster down to make a toast. And then it pops up in my toaster. You can lift the button up.
And it lifts the toast out. So you don't have to go picking it out with a fork or a knife. That's innovation, that's the application of some sort of technology or engineering in this case to solve a human problem. And, uh, I think just because we can do things, whether engineers or technologists or on the internet doesn't mean that we necessarily should.
And if you have the capacity to do something big, make sure you're solving a real problem that exists. Not. Something that doesn't,
I have more respect for my toaster than I do a Toyota Prius. You know, Chad, I'm just now thinking, as he said that I'm thinking about my toaster and we literally have a wooden, uh, sort of chop stick construction to help pick the toast out because my toast, it doesn't do what he's done. It's crazy. Isn't it?
It's like. Oh, well, I don't know how long in toast have been around, but, but why is it so hard to do that? And I'm forever burning the toast even to this very day. It really does call into question for what purpose are we innovating? Doesn't it? Yeah. Of this idea of nonsense innovation. That he, that he kind of calls out here.
I, I would hope that everyone that we've profiled so far on the show doesn't really fit into that, that qualification, but I know that you and I could, could look around us in our pre previous experiences and see a lot of nonsense innovation out there. Yeah. And, and, and as you said, it really points to how he challenges us, makes us think twice, perhaps ask why.
And I think that's right. Really the power of, of what we have install of us, install for us for the rest of the show. So, um, one, one side note, please, everyone, if you want to follow the links to the books or get more information about Simon Sinek or any of the other authors that we've covered. I head off to moonshots.io.
You can get everything you need now chat. We've got a whole bunch of clear. It's coming up here all around this kind of theme of life, hacking and challenging how we think and feel and behave at work. Where do you want to stop this delve into the world of Simon Sinek? Yeah. Well, and don't forget the second block where we really get into Simon on leadership, which I think is one of his strongest suits and where he, where he has, has the most to say, but where, so his book start with why kind of begins at the individual and kind of expands to your organization.
And then his second book. Leaders eat last really kind of takes it from a, from the kind of organization and kind of company point of view. But, um, so I think we can start with the, the core, the Genesis of this Y idea and, and, and Simon, really, they just kind of helping us figure out how to find fulfillment in the work that we're doing.
Isn't it usually like, you know, putting a stake in the ground and having a why. There's a statistic that over 90% of people, uh, go home at the end of the day, feeling unfulfilled by their work. This is the difference between liking your job and loving your job. You can like your job, but do you love your job?
And over 90% of the people who work these days don't, um, and I imagine a world in which that statistic has completely reversed in which the vast majority of people go home at the end of the day, feeling fulfilled by the work that they do, feeling that they've contributed to something bigger than the bigger than themselves.
I've always been a pretty happy go lucky guy. But about five years ago, I reached a point in my career where my passion was gone. Um, I stuffed loving what I was doing, and I even got to the point where I didn't really like it anymore. And for a happy person just being unhappy, it was bad enough. And it was this point in my life that I made this discovery, this thing called the why.
Um, and what I learned is that every single organization on the planet, even our own careers function on three levels, what we do. How we do it and why we do it. These are the things that we think make us different or special compared to everyone else. But very few of us can clearly articulate why we do what we do.
And I don't mean to earn a living or provide for your family. There was a results, um, by why, I mean, what's your purpose, what's your cause? What's your belief. And after I learned my, why I literally stopped telling people what I did and only started telling them what I believed and not only was my passion restored, but my career and my life changed dramatically and took on an entirely, um, uh, new path with, with, with vastly more meaning such a powerful set.
Of ideas asking why not just looking at what you do, but asking how do you do it and why? I can't tell you Chad, how many times I've used this for myself, for the companies that I've worked in for the clients that I've worked for. I mean, this is right up there. This idea is, is right up there with the four hour work week, a book from Tim Ferris.
This. This whole idea of starting with why is really profound for me, because it really uncovers real reasons that we get up in the morning and the real reasons we believe in ourselves and others, you must have as a storyteller, just thought about this. Why framework so many times shad, I mean, how how's it come alive in your life and your work?
Yeah, well, and, and I, you know, I've seen you, you put it in action in real life, Mike, you know, using the, the why framework. So I can tell you listeners that Mike's not just saying that he loves us. He I've, I've seen him do it and, you know, live in the room with, with people before he, he's a true fan. It's interesting for me, because I think as a storyteller, I've kind of intuited this wisdom.
You know, from Simon for a long time, but maybe hadn't articulated it like, like he does. And he has a very simple framework and even diagram or model where he draws three circles and in the outermost circle, he puts what you do. And then in the next circle, and he puts how you. How you do it. And then in the core, the target that he, he he's up there on the stage and he's just kind of like circling and he's, he's marking up the middle of this, you know, telling you that it's really the core of that matters.
And that's the why. And. I kind of see it as my goal as the storyteller to really get to that why as quickly as possible and understand that. And then once you connect with someone, you know, with their why, then it kind of unlocks everything else about them. It kind of unlocks the rest of their being. And then yeah, you see them come alive and they'd become really activated and excited and you can hear it in his voice when he's talking about, you know, being completely disillusioned in what he was.
What he was doing. So this is a bit of a challenge I'm going to give to you, Mike. You don't even have to answer it now, but by the end of the episode, I would like to hear your why. Okay. Only if you agree to do the same. Oh yeah. Well, I'm kind of cheating because I've actually been doing this work, um, on myself a little bit in PR both in preparation for this episode.
Um, but also just, you know, for, for my own, uh, professional development, uh, as I'm, as in billing, I'm totally, I would also challenge you listeners that as you're listening to this episode and learning. Along with us from, from Simon yet there's so much power and just, yeah, writing it down. Uh, your why. Yeah.
So that's just something that I wanted to, uh, to, to challenge you on, uh, this time around. Love it, love it. Well, you know, this whole journey into using the why framework ain't easy, is it, and trying to get to the knob of why you do things and then behaving. In accordance with that, that's probably the biggest challenge.
And what's so great about Simon Sinek is he's written a lot about not only the why framework, but about leadership, about passion, about how you, not only the end point, but how you get there. And this next clip is him really delving into the world. Of of what it really takes to understand courage and what it looks like and feels like, because that's something you're going to call on when you're really trying to be true to why you do things.
So let's have a listen now to Simon Sinek on helping us to understand courage. Courage is an external thing, right? So I have met people who literally have courage. What we would call courage. They have put their lives on the line. They have thrown themselves into harm's way in order to save the life of someone else.
They have done something that we would consider, man, that, that violates all tenants and survive. You know, we're supposed to do things to make, to survive so that someone else will survive. Courage, real courage. And I've talked to them and I always say, why did you do it? You've got a wife, you've got kids.
Why would you do that? And they all give me the same answer every time. Cause they would have done it for me. Cause someone else would have done the same for me. It is the absolute confidence that the person to the left and the person to the right will do the same for me that gives them the courage to do amazing things.
This clip is actually really resonating with me because of what's happening. You know, here we are the beginning of October, 2018, and there's a real swell of support around the me too movement. And I don't want to dwell on it because I'm a straight white guy, but I think the fact that because so many other women are beginning to share and open up.
And we are being receptive to it. That that courage guide I like, I want to be clear, like that is very courageous on, on, on the parts of all of those women, they're able to do it just in the same way that, that, that, that Simon is talking about here. Hmm. And I love this idea because it, you can see in the, in the social dynamic as you've pointed out, but you know what the crazy thing is you think about teams in the office when you know that someone's got your back, because they'd step in to help you when you're in a bind, or even if you go to the sports field.
One of the key things to a defensive system working in, in any form of football, Is that each independent player believes in the other and has the knowledge that the other person would back them up. So that gives them this courage to push forward themselves and is solely this underlying pattern sort of almost how I think the disappointing thing is that probably most organizations don't function in a way where everyone has the confidence.
To know that others are looking out for, for them, you know, above that they're being selfless and not selfish because I think it's the, it's the default to be very selfish. Yeah. Yeah. Getting too meta here in the end. The most selfish thing in the world to do is to be unselfish because you get all the good karma that comes back by putting others first.
Isn't that I think also what he's getting at is like the ins, the incentives and the structures inside of, well, this is probably just within capitalism, you know, it's just, it there's some, there's no incentives for the altruistic motives. You know, if you follow him, if you follow assignment further in his readings and his admonitions to us, like, yeah, it's a bit of a rail against the capitalist system and he's like, well, actually, strangely enough, like it.
If you act in this selfless and courageous way, it's it actually, you know, Leads to higher performing teams and therefore, you know, higher, higher profit. So it's kind of this counterintuitive way to get at, to get at that kind of, uh, success. Um, and, and in the end good day teams, regardless of the form.
Good, sure. Dynamics regardless of the form. All required. Just that little bit of selflessness where you just put others before you, and we've talked about humble leadership, uh, servant leadership before. And I think he's kind of touching on this and you know, if you want to realize your, why I think having that sort of courage around you and the externalities of that amongst others, and what you can do to make that happen is, is what we're learning here.
But he hasn't stopped helping us with some tips on how to get the job done, how to be a great leader, how to pursue your, why, how to have some positive impact on the world. And I love, I mean, this one, this next thought from Simon is all about the hard thing, about hard things. As Ben Horowitz would say, this is all about.
The stoic in all of us. So, uh, let's tune in now to Simon Sinek, giving us a very powerful thought around intensity versus consistency. Great culture, no matter where we are, no matter how big the organization is not about intensity. It's about consistency. You can't get into shape by going to the gym for nine hours.
It won't work, but if you work out every single day for 20 minutes, you will absolutely get into shape. Right. Intensity is like going to the dentist. It's fixed in time. We know exactly what date we're going. We know how long we're going to be there. And we know that when we come out, our teeth will feel smooth and look poorly.
But if that's all we do, all our teeth will fall out. In other words, intensity is not enough. So we're also supposed to brush our teeth twice a day for two minutes in the morning. And two minutes in the evening, what does brushing your teeth do for two minutes? Nothing. It does absolutely nothing. Unless you do it every single day.
Can you leave out a day show? How many days can you leave out? I don't really know. How many times do you have to brush your teeth before? Before? I don't know that either. And this is why companies don't do it because we like intensity. We like things that are fixed in time and ease measured. We want to make leaders.
What do we do? We have a company offsite. We invite a whole bunch of speakers. Everybody gives the event at 8.5 liters. No, no, we like intensity. How do we fix broken companies, reorg new management. We can see the results layoffs. We love it. Look at the savings. Yeah. In the short term, we love intensity for the simple reason that it's easy to measure and we can calculate the day we can calculate the time, highly predictable, but it's consistency.
That is the human part. You know, what does it take to fall in love? Buy her flowers, remember her birthday important. But if that's all you do, it won't work. It's the little things like when you wake up in the morning, you say good morning to her. Before you check your
When you get up to get yourself a drink, you bring one back without asking if they even wanted one. Any one of those things does nothing. It's the accumulation of all of those things done over the course of time. Repeatedly that one day someone will wake up and go, Oh my God, I love you. It's the exact same thing at a company, which is we do these things repeatedly, which is instead of waiting for Charlie to show up at the meeting, who's running a few minutes late and we're all just on our phones waiting for Charlie.
He's just running. Is he here? Just a few more minutes. Okay. Oh, Charlie's here. Good. Let's start the meeting instead. We should have no phones. In conference rooms ever, because you know what happens? We sit in the room and we talk, we go, I heard your mom's in the hospital. Oh yeah. Thanks. Now she's much better.
Thanks for asking. Yeah. Yeah. And that's called building relationships. What does it do? Nothing. It does nothing. But if you do it on a regular basis, over the course of time, what ends up happening is you just discover that you trust your colleagues, that you love your bus, that you believe leave to the core of your being that if something is wrong, that they will be there for you.
And what starts to happen is you start to be willing to be vulnerable, vulnerable doesn't mean walking around crying. That's not what it means. What vulnerable means is I'm willing to raise my hand and say, I made a mistake. I'm not qualified for the job that you gave me. I don't know what I'm doing without any fear that by revealing those things, will you be humiliated or fired?
And here's the joke. It's good for business. Yeah. It's actually the smallest things, but done. Consistently over time. That makes the big difference. I know. I know. And chatted just takes me to the metaphors of going to the gym, eating healthy, good sleep. Yeah. Because I think, yeah, we'll get, we'll get burnt out otherwise.
And it's fascinating to me too, like how similar, you know, an organization or, or a company is to. To us humans. We kind of sometimes think of corporations as these kind of cold personality lists entities at times. But like in this the same way that it's very hard for you or humans to do the consistent things, like, you know, brush our teeth, as assignments says, it's also very hard for the corporations to do the same.
And I've know, he talks about I've been at off sites and I've been at I've. I've been working with companies that have gone through or are going through reorganizations. And, you know, the leadership does think that that will be the silver bullet. When, if you actually just talk to the individuals, they're like, Yeah, my boss doesn't listen to me.
It's like, Oh, if the boss just listened to the person once a week even, or, or said, good job, right. Once a week. Oh, don't even get me sad. Feedback is like crucial to people thriving and engaging in a course. Yeah. But how many times have we been doing work and never once been recognized, looked in the eye and said, Mike, Thank you for the work that you did this, you know, this is the impact that it had.
Yeah. Like it should not be the exception to the rule. That's right. But you know, people are so preoccupied with the things that they're battling. They forget others needs some consistent. Being the key word here, feedback. I'm interested, Chad, like if, if you were to reflect on how you keep consistent on the things that matter, do you have any tips or suggestions on how to keep these positive, consistent habits regardless of work or at home?
How do you kind of keep your consistency? How do you strive to keep the good stuff happening? I'm trying to think if I want to go like the super tactical or, or not. Um, I have, um, I don't even know what the name of the app is, but I have an app on my phone where all you can do is, you know, create a check Mark on a day or not.
And so, you know, for me, it's, you know, did I get my physical activity today or not? And I calculate that in. A lot of different ways. You know, sometimes I bike, sometimes I go to the gym, sometimes I do a lot of walking, but then I just have the whole, you know, 30 day view of the calendar and I can say, Oh, you know, it's mostly full or it's totally full, but great.
Or there's long stretches of emptiness. And then I'm like, Ooh. Yeah, If you just like search on Google, like for don't break the chain, you'll probably come across a story about how Jerry Seinfeld talks about, you know, writing one joke every day, regardless of whether it was good or not. And how you put a big red Mark on his calendar when he did.
And that was really what kind of kept him going, you know, as he was struggling in the, in the small time, you know, comedy cellars. But I think, you know, it just a simple of did I do it today or didn't I do it today is how I do. Do a lot of that, that tracking. Yeah. Yeah. I'm exactly the same. I have this Curry and this is going to show you how a bit intense I can be about productivity.
I actually said as a record occurring daily task, let me count here. One, two, three, four, six, seven, eight, nine, 10, 11. Things are daily recurring tasks, which are my essential habits. That I have to do consistently every day. So everything from there's sleep well, workout deliver one high value deliverable per day.
Like I said, one thing I deliver has to be a bit chunk burn 3000 K a KJS in active energy eat well, write my goals, listen to a podcast, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I actually basically task the things I do every day. And I just have to Mark them as either done or not done. And Jean Hood is such a great way.
I've just forcing myself to have these consistent habits. And I would say like two of those that really stand out is I have to do, I have a task every day to write my journal and to work out and I can't do those two things. Keep me so on track with work, just like the energy I get from working out and the clarity of mind I get from journaling essential tips to consistency.
Yeah, well, um, I will find the name of the app and we can put that in the show notes for, for everyone. There's Simon does a great job of kind of contrasting two very different ideas and telling stories around them. And so I'll just want to jump into this next clip where he's talking about being nervous versus being excited.
I was also watching the Olympics and this is what I made. I realized this one, I was watching the London Olympics. So a couple of weeks ago, and I was annoyed by how all the journalists asked all the athletes the same stupid question, literally everyone. Were you nervous or are you nervous? Whether it was before or after the event?
Every single time. And every single time all the athletes gave the exact same answer. No, I was excited. No, I'm excited. Every single time elite athletes had learned to interpret buddy stimulus. What is, what are the signs of nervousness? Your heart races. You visualize the future. You clap your hands, get clammy.
What are the stimulus for excitement, your heart races. You visualize the future, your hands get clammy. They had learned to interpret. What their buddy was telling them, not as nerves, but as excitement. And the reason the journalists said were you nervous is because they would be nervous. Athletes would never say that to each other.
And they say that was exciting. So I tried it. I did a little test on myself, right? I'm on a plane. We start hitting some really bad turbulence. I go. And then I say to myself, literally out loud, this is exciting. And I was fine and I was fine. So I do it a lot. Now, when I find myself getting nervous, I say to myself, this is so exciting.
And I'll explain the reason to myself. Why? So like an actor, you don't get nervous when you're going on stage anymore, but occasionally you do. So I get to go on stage a lot and I don't really get nervous much anymore, but I was going to present to 3000 chiefs of police, right. In the middle of all this police brutality, uh, uh, hullabaloo.
And yeah, I got really nervous because the stakes were really high, you know, and I was literally getting nervous backstage. And I said to myself, this is so exciting. I have an opportunity to talk to a group of people. We can actually affect change in this country. This is really exciting. Now I could have said the same thing.
I'm so nervous. I'm about to talk to people who can, but the interpretation was excitement. Just change the narrative. It works brilliantly. Well. So the big question I have for you, Chad, is we all face this nervous versus versus excited dilemma. Do you have any, how do you make that transition? Have you tried to make that transition?
Because it's so true, isn't it? It's so easy to shift between these two States. How do you try and be excited and rather than nervous and sweaty and, well, I actually have a word for this, like nervous, cited or nervous excitement. I've conflated the, uh, The ideas before I think because he's so right. It's just, it's though, they're kind of on, at, on other sides of like the, you know, the edge of the blade and you can kind of fall one way or the other where I geek out in this is nervous.
Newness and excitement are self narratives. And in, in not to get all Tony Robbins on you, but like, it is just a mindset shift, uh, to, to change one into the other. And I don't want to gloss over, I think the most powerful part of Simon's hack here is he said it out loud, the physical embodiment of saying, Oh, this is exciting.
That is how you like flip the switch from nervous mint, nervousness to excitement. So like someone like Tony Robbins who may have in his prior life, gotten very nervous before going out in front of a group of. 400 people to change their lives. He's jumping on a trampoline behind, behind the stage, like to embody that excitement, you know, like to get going in and get excited, um, rev the engines.
So I think that, um, Yeah, just that, that simple reframe, um, is really powerful. And it's so interesting to me too, because again, as, as a storyteller, like, yeah, it there's some nuance there, but yeah, you just have to begin to tell yourself a different story and it can be very, very different experiences.
Yeah, I would just add one thing on that, which is the way I shift from being nervous, cited. A thing that you can do other than just changing your mental frame is be prepared because when you give a talk, if you spent time writing it out, Rehearsing. It it's so much easier to embody excitement and to know you've got something really good really to offer the audience.
And I would say, or is again the same with sport. We all know when we're walking out in a game and we're not prepared, you feel it. And that's why you nervous. But if you're fit strong, got a good team plan. You've got each other's backs. That's when, you know, Hey guys, I'm pumped, I'm excited. I want to do this.
And so I think preparation would be a big tip to give our listeners here. This is how you can make that shift from nervous to excited. And I think that all of this kind of takes place in a sort of a bigger field. I think getting excited. Is easier to do when you love what you do. And to wrap up this whole first half of the show, I think it's really important for us to remember that you've got to go back to your why.
And make sure that whatever you're doing really supports that because then as we've talked about, you can have the courage, you can bring the consistency to the game, but you can also make this shift from nervous to excited. So I think to kind of frame this whole life hacking advice that Simon has for us, I think that's really the flow that we want our listeners to get into.
So before we jump into our book review and we go over into the leisure. I think it's really important that the carrier's consistency and excitement. All starts with knowing why you're on the planet. What gets you up? What drives everything you do? How can you bring it all back to one thing? So I feel like Simon has given us a lot to chew on there.
I mean, you know, you, you have placed that challenge, uh, to, to me. And it's so funny, even though I think about a lot when you're like, Oh, Michael, when you're doing, you're like, who, you know, it is, it's a big meal to digest. Isn't it, Chad? Yeah, and it it's ever it's ever changing, but yeah, let's, um, let's hear what, uh, Simon has to say on the subject.
Passion is not an actionable word. It's correct. You know, that those who do the things that they're passionate about do better, but it's not helpful advice. Um, and so the question is where does passion come from? Um, passion is a result. Passion is an energy. Um, passion is the feeling you have when you're engaged in something that.
You love passion is the feeling you have, that you would probably do this for free, you know, and you can't believe somebody pays you do it, you know? Um, and I think we mistake that and it's something we do in our private lives, but it shouldn't be done, you know, in our careers for example. And I'm a firm believer that you are, who you are.
And anybody who says I'm different at home than I am at work. And one of those two places you're lying and the goal is to make everything you do in home and at work, something that you have to do. So how do you find the things that you're excited to do? Well, it's actually. Easier than you think. What are the things that you love to do?
What are the things that you would do for free? You know, how can you recreate that feeling and, and be paid for it? So what are the things that I do on the weekend? Right. I love, um, I'm very involved in the art world. I love to go to museums and galleries, but I love to go see dance and performances because I want to see how others are.
Or interpreting the world. So that inspires me, new ideas, new thoughts, new ways of looking at the world are things that interest me privately. We, and I seek it out and pay money for it. Right. So does that mean I have to have career in the arts? No, it means I have to have a career where new ideas are explored, where people are experimenting and trying things out.
And I have to explore new ideas and try things out. And I'm just as excited to go to work every day as I am. You know, go do something on a Saturday night. Um, and so the idea of finding your passion is ironically simple because you should be doing stuff that you enjoy sometimes. What is the stuff that you enjoy?
And then what is the stuff that you love, who are the people that you love and what are those, what do they all have in common? What I would offer to our audience here is the greatest litmus test of finding your passion. Is would you go to your office and do your work for free? I think Chad, I think that is such a great challenge and you don't have to.
Say yes. Yes, of course. Of course. Maybe get some bits and the great question from that, with what, which bits and how can you do more of them? I love this idea. There's no difference between work you home. You it's just you and you should be doing the stuff you love. And I cannot tell you, this is being such a, the big thing in, in my quest in life.
Uh, and since I read his book is to do what I love and to try and get my work is close to being things that I would do I do for free because they bring me so much joy satisfaction show. That can be hard. I don't always like. It day to day, but boy, do I love the mission? How Chad, how have you got to doing your passion?
You made a huge switch in your time at college. I mean, how did, how do you follow your passion? How do you keep on track with that? Or is it interesting? Cause I was a super. Nerd my younger years, very into the, you know, man, you just built your own PC. You're trying to tell me that's changed. Well, yeah, that's true.
Um, I guess I still am, but um, yeah, no, I, I was, I was very into, you know, math and science STEM. Uh, although it wasn't called that back. When, when I was in school, the, and I still think that I could find some real interest in passion in that work. I just don't think maybe I'm quite smart enough to do, to do it anymore, at least in that way.
Um, But I think, yeah, it was one class. It was one teacher in that that really transformed. I think like my, my understanding of what my possible futures could be. And I was like, Oh, that's what I want to do. Like, I want to tell stories. I want to, I want to. Connect with people and help them share their stories.
And I'm giving, I'm giving a little bit of my why away here,
actually. I'll just, I'll just go ahead and state it. I've I've recently written it down, but I am on a mission to accelerate the pace of innovation by sharing stories from the frontier of work and culture. From the frontier, Chad Owen boy, that is expensive. And tell me how much, how many times did you have to think and write that through?
Like what did it take to get? Oh, it's still, it's still changing. It might change this hash, but no, it's, it was a really, it was a really great exercise for me to go through and, you know, preparing for this show kind of reinspired me to revisit it. You know, you'll notice that innovation in that keyword is, is, is in the title, you know, like you and I are showing up in podcasting.
We're not getting paid, like where I see this podcast as directly connected to my, my why. Right. To accelerate the pace of innovation by sharing stories. Like that's what we're doing, right. Yeah. I totally get my clients. Yeah. You know, it's, it's, it's fun for me to see like, The, my, why is both kind of from within me, but it's also like I'm looking at what I have done and have been doing, and also crafting my why around the best parts of what I am doing.
And so this is maybe kind of how, like, I mean, I just want to call it out, Mike, you and I are so fortunate to be in the positions that we are to work in our passions. Um, but many people. Aren't or are struggling to figure out how to do it. And that I would just, you know, in reflecting and how I've kind of come in to stating this.
Why, like, I would just advise people to look at the best parts of, of, of their work experience and their, their personal experience and like make a list. It's like, Oh, this is where I really come alive. And this is where I'm really activated and really impassioned. And then, you know, begin to craft your why statement around that, and then just do more of it, you know, as best as you can.
And, um, oftentimes, you know, you have that opportunity in your workplace. Sometimes you have to try to actively transform your, your work and then others, you, you have to leave that work behind and, and move on. But yeah, that was, um, that's been my experience, uh, and in crafting my own. Why. And I think just having the fortitude to really go and ask why, and that almost will set you on the course.
I mean, Chad, I would propose that if you re, if any of our listeners go about this exercise of asking what they do, how they do, why they do it and reflect on it just a little bit, it's almost a self fulfilling prophecy. I feel like once you go, Oh my gosh. Yes. Then you just get on the freight train. You just get going.
Don't you. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that everyone should pick up, start with why, but like, like you might, it's certainly in the top of my, my reading, my reading list, but I can wholeheartedly recommend it to like, to everyone, my mom, my, you know, my brother, my like every, everyone, the person that sits next to me in the coworking space, strangers on the subway.
I think B because he gives us a really. Easy to understand and, and simple framework to begin to discover our why. I won't say it's easy, but the framework is simple. You still got to sit down and do the work, but yeah, I think. Uh, it, it, it, it is a wholehearted recommendation for me. Uh, and, and, and you too.
I, I, I believe, yeah. I mean, we're totally just digging deep on our official Chad Owen book radio, and I'm telling you start with why is, I mean, You just can't go wrong reading this thing. Does this to give you an idea. So I must have read this what five, seven years ago today I was with a clients, a large media company here in Australia, and we're working on seven, really quite radical products.
And with all of the teams that are building and working on these businesses and products. Much of the time. I was like, that problems sounds good, but let's ask her why this business, why this product, it really exists and how can we make the mission bigger? So I was like, totally unintentional. But just Simon Sinek was just pouring out of me.
And that's how powerful the book is. I mean, I've read a ton of books since then, all to do with building product all about innovation and I'm still going back. It is such a simple for any work. I mean, he's impossible to forget. And it can really light a big fire. So I think start with why by Simon Sinek, top 10 and not far off it is leaders eat last.
Why some teams pull together and others don't. And this one, uh, you, you told, you told your little vignette from the book. The one thing that has stuck in my mind, and this was, I believe it was correct me. If I'm wrong, Chad, he tells the story of the Marines and how they do the breakfast, lunch and dinner.
Was it the Marines? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So check this out. So he tells the story of, you know, this is like kind of this elite army force, it's the U S Marines. But when they get to the mess hall for lunch, it's actually the young cadets that actually get to eat first. And the most senior Marines eat last. And I'm like, Oh, that doesn't sound like the, how the army would work.
And he goes on to explain, obviously that the Marines are in like the front line of the most intense, most mission, critical jobs and the essence to everything sticking together as a team is that the youngest, the least experienced Marines know that they have the protection, the coverage from the elder statesman.
In the Marines and this is the core practice they do to enforce it. Every time they eat, they know someone's got their back. And I was just like, uh, gosh, because so much of corporate life is hierarchical and the boss has the corner office in the best car spot. No, no, no, no, no. It shouldn't be like that at all.
And it such a powerful reminder that we can look around us and find inspiration for how leadership really looks and feels. So that's why I loved leaders eat last, both books, Chad pool. Recommended reading from the moonshots podcast. Yeah. And they're, they're short reads, uh, you know, relative to some of the other books that have been written by people we've profiled on the podcast.
And he's just a great storyteller, you know, it's not the dry, boring case studies that you might get in some other business books. Yes. They're, they're very, they're very memorable and, and in great real world applications and examples of what he's, what he's talking about. And the, the clips in this last half of, of the show are I think the culmination and combination of, of both books and, and how that's formulated Simon's views and advice on leadership.
And so first maybe we can just get kind of an overview, uh, from him on, on how and why it's important to lead in a new way. One of the great things that is lacking in most of our companies is that they are not teaching us how to lead. And leadership is a skill like any other is a practicable learnable skill.
And it is something that you work on. It it's like a muscle. If you practice it all the days, you will get good at it. And you will get become a strong leader. If you stop practicing, you will become a weak leader like parenting. Everyone has the capacity to be a parent. Doesn't even everybody wants to be a parent and doesn't mean everybody shouldn't be a parent.
Leadership is the same. We all have the capacity to be a leader. Doesn't mean everybody should be a leader. And it doesn't mean everybody wants to be a leader. And the reason is because it comes at great personal sacrifice. Remember, you're not in charge. You're responsible for those in your charge. That means things like when everything goes right, you have to give away all the credit.
And when everything goes wrong and you have to take all the responsibility that sucks, right? It's things like staying late to show somebody what to do. It's things like when something does actually break, when something goes wrong, instead of yelling and screaming and taking over, you say, try again. When the overwhelming pressures are not on them, the overwhelming pressures are on us.
At the end of the day, great leaders are not responsible for the job. They're responsible for the people who are responsible for the job. So Chad, for me, the line in that, that is just punching me in the face. Is that when we think about leadership, you are not in charge. You have to care for the people in your charge.
And putting them before yourself, it's almost contradictory to the modern picture of any sort of leader in any, any sort of political business. Spotlight is so much it's about the hero leader, isn't it. And very little of it is about the servant leader. Those that put others before themselves. I love this idea of that.
You're not in charge. You have to take care of the people. In your church. Yeah. I think his view of leadership is so antithetical that. I think a lot of people read and listened to him and just outright dismiss him. You really think that they dismiss him. He's he's so good at telling us well, it's it, his view is just like, so antithetical to how they see themselves.
Like I see this rejection of this idea of this servant leader so much. I mean, I I'm, I'm right there with you. Mike, but I think we still have a long ways to go to fully, fully incorporate it. And I think maybe one thing that I'm not doing very well right now is that thing around giving away the credit and taking the full responsibility.
And I think being, being better at consistently giving the, the, the feedback and the praise. And taking more full ownership. I think that's something that everyone in every organization can can do. And I think it will, it will lead to better teams. It really does. You're really onto something there. I mean, he really points out this key moment and it's where you feel the full way of leadership where he's like, so when everything's going really, really well, you can't take any of the credit.
And when things are going really, really bad, you got to take all the fault. And then you're like, Oh, that is so what it's about. And it's so hard to do because it's just like tough, tough, tough stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and actually I have, here's an interesting example. So maybe I was a little too hard on myself.
Aye. Yeah. I was producing a project for an overseas client. And they needed four different shoots across two days and four locations in North and South California. It's tough to be honest, eat his dinner and I'm like better you than me. Oh, well. So, you know, I made it happen and the client was, but I wasn't on the ground.
Um, for all of it, you know, I can't be in two places at once. So, you know, we uploaded all the footage and clips and the client was reviewing it and I got this great. Short email from the client of like, this is nothing short of spectacular, you know, all of our previous, you know, companies that we worked with in the U S like haven't delivered the same results.
And that made me feel good. And then I could have just simply responded and been like, yeah, you know, of course, this is why, what I do. But then I was like, Oh, you know what, actually, this would be best if I sent it to my, to my producers and shooters they're on the ground and they might, you know, collaborators.
I was like, Oh, okay. So then I just copied. And pasted what the client wrote and just sent it to my team. And it was like, thanks everyone. And you know, the client's thrilled. It doesn't sound like a whole lot, but they all responded and said, thanks. Like, we're so glad. That, that it turned out that way.
That's great. That's what Simon's talk. Yeah, there you go. Signs. This happened yesterday. It literally happened yesterday. Wow, man. That's super. That's really super. Yeah. Look just on lock does get the two books, read them. There's so much in, in, in this end. Building on this idea of putting others before yourself is really this path to leadership.
The other thing Simon Sinek brings to us really well is that in that day to day action, there's a lot of these sort of interactions between people. And what we sometimes forget is that these are all chances to build trust. It's between two people in a relationship. And he's got some great thinking on that.
So let's listen to Simon Sinek talking about how to establish trust when you're building a relationship. Trust is the result. Something you can't tell people trust me. Um, uh, trust cannot be formed overnight just as you can't go on one date and decide if you wanna marry someone. I mean, it doesn't, you know, you might, you might have lust, you know, um, but there's no real trust.
Um, the best definition of love I ever heard is is, is that you can give someone the power to destroy you and trust that they won't use it. You know, and that's kind of what trust is. It's this deep love, and it comes over, um, over time and it comes from taking lots of little risks, you know, exposing yourself to more danger, making yourself feel more vulnerable, sharing something personal, putting yourself in a position where you have to turn your back and hope somebody won't stab you or steal your stuff.
I mean, this is what trust is. It is the result of, um, You're making someone feel safe and them making you feel safe and it's that debts. That's what it is. Can't be one sided, you know? And it's, again, it's like, it's like dating. It's like getting to know someone it's like making friends that does not, it happened overnight.
And it's a dance of give and take, give, and take, give, and take, give and take. And when you feel that that's, um, that that person will make you feel safe, trust will emerge. It's not an app. It's not a switch. It's not something you turn on. It's something that evolves. You start to feel it. And then one morning you wake up and you're like, Oh my God, I totally trust that person.
You're not sure exactly what happened to get you there, but you find yourself there. Yeah. I think this connects a lot to me, to his idea of consistency and that it's not a grand gesture. That's going to. Get someone to trust you. It's those little things every day that that's going to build that trust in between, between you and the other person.
And I think, um, you know, I think about how we work together. I have absolute trust. That all the production, all the Polish on our final product will be done because some 40 episodes in over a year of recording together, almost 20,000 listens. I just know. I know you're going to get it done. I can totally trust it.
And that's what comes from from that consistency idea. But I guess where, where we should really point this towards is it only comes over time through these small moments. And what we have to be aware of is each moment is an opportunity to either build or lose trust. And my experience has been. It takes, it's slow and hard to build trust, but it's fast and easy to lose trust.
Yeah. Yeah. In the same way that I always wake up with clips in my inbox to, uh, to listen to. Uh, in preparation for the show. Yeah. That's kind of a scary idea though, Mike, like that, that trust takes a long time, but it can be broken really easy, easy that I don't know that that, that idea is just real. It's kind of scary to me.
It is. And I th I think that, um, What you see is you think about right sports teams or great bands, then they never come out. Yeah, nowhere, there's all this hard work. And we've talked a lot about, there's no such thing as an overnight success. There's always the backstory. And when there's more than one person involved, if they've played together so much, Uh, on the stage as a band on the court, as a basketball team, it doesn't matter.
The familiarity is there, but I'll go back to the courage is when you know, you just know the other guy is going to carry for you. You just know the other guy's going to be, and you look at a sports team that's on fire. The quarterback, he can just throw the pass and knows the guy will get there. Or in defense, he knows that I don't have to worry about the, the guy next to me doing his job.
I know he's going to do it. In fact, I know he's probably got my back too. Um, that to me is like the sense of trust and it's just damn hard work. But what comes of that is I think, I think there's the permission, at least the starting point for you to become a leader and for people around you to look to you.
And that's why I think trust is so essential to each ad. Yeah. Yeah. It's the showing up every day and. Showing others that, that you will show up for them and, and, and be there for them or, you know, or have their back. Yeah. I mean, it's very interesting how all of these ideas are very interrelated. You know, that, that, that it's like the work of a leader is actually a trust building.
Yeah. Tend to task project and there's, and, and, and Simon speaks a lot about the difference between right versus leadership. Actually, this next clip goes right to the heart. Ah, he's got this really powerful thought. So let's have a listen to Simon Sinek talking about managing around you by turning all the people around you from followers.
Into leaders themselves. I'm learning to manage teams by allowing the teams to do more themselves. Um, there's a, um, a brilliant leader by the name of David Marquet who wrote a book called turn the ship around. And he hadn't experienced as a submarine captain on the USS center Fe, where. He realized that as much as he knew about some reading, you know, he'd been a submariner, his whole career, um, that put on this new submarine, he learned the hard way.
They actually didn't know how the submarine worked. He, he, he, he, he made an order that nobody knew how to do it because there was that didn't exist on that sub. And so he realized he had no choice, but to trust his people. And he went through this transformation as a leader of. Telling everybody what to do to allowing people to tell him what should be done.
Um, and I've, I've learned a lot from him and I highly recommend his book. Um, and, uh, and I I've, I've really learned that, which is, you know, at the top of the organization, As David says, the people have all the authority, the leaders have all the authority, but at the bottom they have all the context. Right.
And so you can't just push all the context up, you have to push the authority down. Um, and so the responsibility of leadership is to train people, make sure that they have the skillset help build their confidence. That they have the confidence to do what needs to be done. They have to have competence and confidence, right.
And that's, that's your job. That's the only job of the leader. It makes you, it's like, like a parent, make sure they have competence and confidence, you know, to make sure your kids get schooling and make sure that they believe in themselves and then leave them, you know? And so I've, I've done the same thing instead of sort of showing people how I would do it.
I want them to learn how it's done, you know, and feel good about themselves. And then just however they do it is how they do it, you know? Um, and the result is remarkable. Um, people feel better about coming to work. They feel like they have something to contribute. They feel more valuable as opposed to just being told, this is how I would do it, or I'm going to do it this way or do it my way.
Um, so yeah, I'm completely changing my understanding of my job as, um, more like a. Parent than a manager has had remarkable impact. Hmm. This, this clip really, as we've listened to, I think maybe nine, nine clips so far, there's this idea of like, just not being different people, right. When we're at work. And, you know, I love how he draws on.
The military or the, the, the best parts of the military. And, and, and, uh, you know, when he's, when he's trying to learn about leadership and parenting, like how, how different is the military in parenting? But he's like, look, you know, there's a lot to be learned from both, but I think if I had to boil down a lot of what he's saying is like, don't, don't try to be a different.
Person or different people at, at work then when you're going through going through your daily lives. Because like, yeah. It's like, yeah, I don't go home and be like, well, you know, I'm the authority. And I have all the control over like this. Like my wife would not stand for that with my dog. Because let's be real.
The dog is the real boss. I think we both realize we're at the bottom of the pecking order or at home, we've come to, to acknowledge and accept this reality. Yeah, but yeah, this idea of like inverting the pyramid, so to speak of leadership is really fascinating to me. It is, it is because, because it is contrarian and, but there's some underlying authenticity, just be yourself, put others before yourself and don't just be consumed with what you do, but think about how and why you do it.
And just be a little bit more self aware and tune into the things. Around you. And I just love this idea of. Empowering those around you so that, you know, they can really go into the best version of themselves. And I think that's, that is like such a great management tip and we've, we've all run into the worst bosses ever, and you can spot the phone is a mile away and.
Manages that kind of choke the life out of you. Yeah. Life's too short to be around those. And I think they're getting you to do things for them. Right. That's kind of their whole worldview instead of them doing things for you so that you can do the things that you are meant to do. Right. Right, right, right.
That is like Simon Sineck is violently agreeing with this right here, but we've got one more thought, Chad, and this is the essence of this latter book leaders eat last and Oh my gosh. Have I committed the crime of trying to be the first one to speak in a meeting so many times? Oh, bad mind. Bad mic. Okay.
So, um, let's get ready for our last clip, but it's certainly not least this is Simon Sinek. Speaking on why you should always be the last to speak. If you agree with somebody don't nod. Yes. If you disagree with somebody don't not know. You will be told your whole life that you need to learn to listen. I would say that you need to learn to be the last to speak.
I see it in boardrooms every day of the week. Even people who consider themselves good leaders who may actually be decent leaders will walk into a room and say, here's the problem. Here's what I think. But I'm interested in your opinion. Let's go around the room. It's too late. The skill to hold your opinions to yourself until everyone has spoken, does two things.
One, it gives everybody else the feeling that they have been heard, it gives me, it gives everyone else the ability to feel that they, I have contributed to you get the benefit of hearing what everybody else has to think before you render European. The skill is really to keep your opinions to yourself.
Simply sit there and take it all in. And the only thing you're allowed to do is ask. Questions so that you can understand what they mean and why they have the opinion that they have. You must understand from where they are speaking, why they have the opinion they have, not just what they're saying. And at the end, then you will get your turn.
It sounds easy. See, it's not practice being the last to speak. Inspiring music aside, um, a corollary that I will add to that this, and this is something that he can start doing today is. You can self nominate yourself as is a bit of a facilitator, or you can ask someone to do this, but just be sure that every person is called.
So just start with the person sitting, let's say to the right of those. So there's this so-called boss in the, in the meeting or highest paid person or hippo as it's often called. Um, Hmm. And be sure that every single person and just go around the room and say, okay, it's your turn, your turn, your turn. And then at the end, you'll get to the boss.
And, and again, I know that sounds kind of juvenile, like something that we did in elementary school. It ensures that not only are we the leaders or the last to speak, it's also giving everyone a voice, which I think is also really important or really important takeaway for me from, from what Simon is saying here.
Yeah. For, yeah. I think what we're learning to build on what you're saying. I think what we're learning here is. Don't be selfish to think you should speak first, hold your tongue. But it's, it's this the beautiful notion of just allow others to speak and you're giving them a gift of empowerment, but Oh, by the way, you get to hear all their opinions and then speak.
So you get more phone view, you're more worldly. You have biggest spectrum on which you can. Understand a given problem or an opportunity. And whilst it's so simple, it's like, you know, allowing, uh, the young cadets to eat first while all these things can sound maybe very simple. I think in practice, what.
Chad you and I are calling out is how often these things don't happen. And it's really about Simon. Sinek is reminding us of some very powerful behaviors, uh, in which we can lead in which we can live a better life. Um, but this one of speaking last, this one is. This one's real big and it's so hard to do.
Often you just bursting. You're like, let me, let me, let me, I gotta think of
it also, if you are, if you're, you know, formulating your thoughts to jump in, to speak, you're not listening to what is being said. And there's this really interesting practice for me on this podcast. To be sure that I listen to you instead of, you know, thinking of what I'm going to say as a response, you know, we have the magic of editing where we can kind of, you know, Shorten the pauses between, you know, things that you and I are saying, but like often people are really uncomfortable with that silence.
But I think again, so in, in giving everyone a voice and then also being sure that you're listening because you're right. It's like, if you don't have that input, you don't you're, you don't have the context, you don't have the information that you need to be able to make the decisions that you need to do.
If you just jump right in you, you've already kind of poisoned the waters, so to speak. And then. Everyone's just going to go along with what you're saying and not contribute their own ideas. Yeah. And perhaps you might even, I, you, those that speak the less, the least in general often carry the best ideas cause they're watching and listening.
They're not busy talking they're observers of the world. My gosh, Simon Sinek. Look, this guy is still pretty young. He's already knocked out some pretty. Oh, man. He gets right up there with the likes of Jim Collins who wrote good to great, you know, he's producing some pretty Epic books and, you know, good news.
He's got another one coming. He's finished it, so. Oh really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Just when I was doing my research, I stumbled upon, this is a really lovely thing where he posted, uh, he was, he had his nephew and niece over at his house and they wanted to see his new book and he. You said it's only on the computer and it's this great show of them explaining the book to them.
Yeah, really, really great stuff. I honestly am Tim Ferris, four hour workweek, Jim Collins. Good to great innovators dilemma from, from clay. A lot of that stuff fuels every day. Oh, what about, what about the lean startup? Funny, you should mention that channel or do you, do you think we should maybe do a show on that Eric fella?
Huh, maybe episode 42, perhaps funny. You should mention that. Yes, the lean startup area, Greece. And, um, wow. Is that one going to be a treat? I mean, everywhere you go in the business world, it's agile. Oh, this and lean that I even still, this thing, Chad, like someone was some lean. You don't remember Sigma six.
Right. You know, that GE management thing. Yeah. Now there's like agile, Sigma, six ninjas and stuff running around big companies. I'm like, I can't keep up with all of this stuff, but there's a reason people are into lean. Uh, and it's it's, uh, I mean, we would do it a lot of lean stuff today here in Sydney and my gosh.
It's so powerful. It really, really is. So we've got like the next show is all about the lean startup. How many companies have you met Chad in the last five or six years who are all practicing, celebrating and drinking the Koolaid on lean startup. The F the funniest thing is that my first paying client, when I first moved to New York city was called lean startup, man.
Oh my gosh. That is going way back in the Tony show. How long ago was that? Eight years. Seven years ago. Six seven years ago. Oh my gosh. Yeah. I mean, it was right when the, I think right around the time the book came out and yeah, I was working for a company called lean startup machine. So it's funny. Cause it's partially what kind of got me on this whole innovation training, uh, was, was starting to work with companies that were very in tuned with what.
What Eric was, you know, his, his teachings and methodologies, but yeah, I, every other PR practically every other client and company, if they're not trying to practice and implement it, they at least know of it. Are these. Yes, exactly. So what a fitting way to finish in our next show? Our author series, you know, we've had Drucker Christians and now scenic, and to come Eric recent lean startup.
And you want to give a little tease to what might come after. I think we're going to have a special edition show. Chad. Yeah. We want to bring back some guests on the show. We have. Loved having the likes of Lauren and Gary, Mary and Brandon and, and, you know, yeah, I think we're going to go back and ask Gary to be on the show and do a bit of like a history of innovation.
We've got kind of some other more thematic shows, maybe not individually focused shows, but if you, the listener have any ideas. For either people or companies that you would like us to, to profile, please get in touch with us. You can find everything@moonshots.io, or you can email us directly@helloatmoonshots.io.
We love hearing from all of you from all across the globe. Mike and I are just taking a look at. Um, some of our statistics, yes. Come on. Before we hopped out, there was some Cray easy stats. I mean, we should say, Hey, so the lessons were almost hitting 20,000 and plays from all four corners of the planet.
It's ridiculous. Every continent. We've got listeners in Singapore, Nigeria, Australia, Brooklyn, Chicago, India, and lady Gaga is taking the crown for the most popular show. She is on a streak. Totally crushing it. Also really, really interesting to see all the different apps, people using Stitcher, overcast, Apple of course, taking first position there.
And, uh, yeah, just the listens of booming at the moment, you know, Angela Ahrendts, uh, could give the Gaga a bit of a challenge for most popular show. Very interesting. Isn't it? Yeah. And after, after we bring Gary back on the show, we're going to take a turn to the investing world here from the likes of Charlie Munger, Warren buffet, Paul Graham, Peter teal, and, um, I just finished a really good book, uh, about Peter teal and a Gawker.
Uh, and that, that whole take-down was called conspiracy by Ryan holiday. Um, yeah, so that's still, that's still a couple months out, but I'm really excited, uh, to, to, to dive in. Uh, and do that series as well. Yeah. Sorry. A real passion series after that we should teach. That will be the architect series, the great architects.
So, yeah. And that'll take us, that'll take us through episode 50. Holy smoke man. And you know, the funny thing is we just keep coming up with new, amazing people to guest on the show, uh, entrepreneurs and innovators. To study and learn from it's. It's been a real joy. And I tell you what we have learned a lot today from Simon Sinek.
So as you go about your day in Brooklyn chat, what, is there any, a Simon Sinek isms that you'll take with you? Is there one that you think you might focus on? I like this idea of listening and yeah. Just letting everyone know that I've got their back a, there you go. There you go. That is, Oh, Mike, I can't let you go.
We haven't heard your why. Oh, okay. Well, so Kemi I hear is mine is not, you almost got it. Um, It's not as polished as yours. So I'm feeling very inadequate about that, but let's let's here it is. Oh, it's always a work. It's always, so, uh, okay. Work-wise you know, what I do is I think I help people create brave new products.
So helping people part is a big area of focus and then the brave new products. I love it. The the how here. And this has been a pretty recent breakthrough for me is I want to be very much with my team, with my clients and with the end users of these products, I really want to. Um, be sort of like this helper, this mentor, this advocate, this sort of coach to them.
So it's shift for me, cause I, I would say the chap, I really fell into my early part of my career. Was trying to be the superstar and I've shifted into trying to make others the star and I'm more behind the scenes. So that's how I do it, sort of that coach archetype. And the reason that I do all of that with, I would say.
So the idea of empowering people, all of those people in that sort of all those constituents to do great things like to help people really do brave new products, make a difference is really, uh, such a rewarding journey for me. And the beauty of it is because I'm helping them so much. It's really rewarding for them.
So the quid pro quo, the sort of you get what you give. Is so big because it's brave new software in the world to do amazing things. And just being on that journey with them is just so deeply satisfying for me. And they seem to think it's okay too. So that's why I do it all. Thank you for sharing a bit.
Rough. I need a copywriter. No it can. You stated it right up front. Like you want to help others bring brave new products or create brave new products. Yeah, we can go back to the tape. You can, you can just transcribe it. Yeah. You said you said it right up front. There we go. There we go. My why and my X, Y.
So now it's time to find your why. Don't forget to check out, start with why and leaders eat last, both really great books. Yeah. We'll have links to them in the, in the show notes and lots of great Simon sittings for a cynic or related content. So go out, make that future happen today in Brooklyn, Chad. I on the other hand will close my laptop, leave the studio and head straight home to collapse on the bed after a rather Epic day.
But Simon Sinek has given me the zest to make it home. All is good in the world. I want to thank you, Chad, for everything that you shared with us today on the show. Enjoy your Brooklyn morning and what's to come. And I will wish you farewell from Sydney Australia. Thank you to all our listeners. That is a wrap of the moonshots cast.