Satya Nadella: Learn SOmething NEw
EPISODE 118
In episode 118, we are delving into some of Satya Nadella’s secrets to success and how to stay humble, keep learning and be grounded.
Satya Nadella is the CEO of Microsoft. He knew he always wanted to be a part of something that empowered people and brought world-changing impact and he quickly felt part of the team at Microsoft that was swiftly making that happen.
His strengths lie in his learnings both personally and professionally. That empathy is the path to success in both leadership and business, and performance matters every day, don’t wait for tomorrow to do your best work. He simply loves reading and cricket. He often says that the game has taught him leadership and teamwork skills and like many successful people, he is passionate about knowledge and learning something new.
“Have a growth mindset", Satya Nadella
SHOW OUTLINE
INTRO
Satya and how opportunity allows you to follow your passions
Talent is Everywhere. But Opportunity is not (2m13)
PERSONAL PERFORMANCE
Be humble, keep learning, be grounded
Have a growth mindset (2m20)
Book reference: Carol Dweck, Growth Mindset
Saying is not the same as doing, so follow through with behavior
Lead by example (2m11)
Your performance matters every day
Don’t wait for the next job to do your best work (2m13)
LESSONS ON LEADERSHIP
Start with the consideration of others
Empathy is a path to success (3m48)
Confidence and judgment comes from exercising a muscle
How cricket can teach you to be a leader (2m24)
OUTRO
Advice Satya would give himself, and all of us!
Harmonize the way you work with others (1m30)
TRANSCRIPT
Welcome to the moonshots podcast. It's episode 118. I'm your co-host Mike Parsons. And I'm joined by Mr. Mark Pearson Freeland. Good morning, Mark. Hey, good morning, Mike. And what an action packed. Episode 118. We've got a head for us today. Mm. I hope you're feeling a little bit gross mindset. I, um, I, but just before we actually reveal to our listeners, Mike, what a fascinating process we've had throughout this entire leadership series so far, you know, we had Tom Brady to kick us off the greatest of all time.
Yeah, Jeff Bezos, the, uh, the Bay myth himself, as well as an incredibly [00:01:00] inspirational episode that I've thoroughly enjoyed myself. Uh, Christine Legon. I mean, what a, what an action packed, uh, three shows we've already had. Yeah, I would say three very. Um, nuanced and different styles of leadership. Um, the, the outcomes, the results they're, they're not up for debate, but it's, it is very, um, there's a sense of.
Like aha. When you see that, actually everybody has their own unique way, their own unique style. There is without doubt, a huge pattern of consistencies amongst moonshot is, are amongst innovators. But, um, despite all those similarities, there's still lots of room for your own flavor of being the best version of yourself and boy to round out the leadership series Mac, have we got one today?
We do we have none other than Satya Nadella, the incredible inspirational CEO of Microsoft. Who's been the CEO of Microsoft since 2014, teen and Annie. Talk about a leader who has his own style, you know, just digging into the show today, Mike, the clips that we've got to listen to. It's it's clear that he's just a lovely chap.
Well, you know, that's half the battle. Don't you think when you're looking for colleagues and teammates, uh, just people that you could go grab a coffee with, have a beer, and you don't have to be besties, but I mean, he's certainly a very agreeable guy and I'll tell you who else is feeling rather agreeable and that's Microsoft shareholders since he came along because.
I, I want to lay this on you Mark, prior to such a, you know, Microsoft, it was big, but it wasn't really growing a ton. And it certainly had a lot of missteps [00:03:00] and there was lots of a conversation around Microsoft. And why is it going such? It comes along 2014 and what a sea change he has had such. A fantastic impact on that organization.
I have worked with folks. And the old Microsoft and the new Microsoft, and I can tell you their love and the new Microsoft. And, uh, I think this is a celebration of his unique style of leadership, which we're going to unpack on the show, how he unlocks his own personal performance, which we'll also do on the show.
And we're really going to ask ourselves, how can we all do it? Like such a, so I am so fired up to do this because he really is. He's different to Christine who is obviously different to Jeff who was different to Tom, more learning in front of us. Mark it's what, a way to do it, huh? Yeah. And going back to your earlier point, Mike, this, uh, [00:04:00] just reveals to you and I, and all of our listeners, how many unique.
Types of leadership is out there. How many lessons we can still learn from those who we see in the papers or those who are leading the companies that we admire, but also our colleagues and leaders, managers that we work with. Day-to-day I do believe that what's really interesting about, um, you know, digging into people like Satio as well as Christine and so on is there's that little consistency that you mentioned that little line.
But each person has a different approach, slightly different taste to it. So Mike, why don't I kick us off and introduce the first clip? Let's do this. Let's get into it. All right, guys. Well, I'm really excited. Let's get Satya to introduce the show to us by having a little bit of a moment to reflect. Back on his past, back to a time when he was not CEO of Microsoft.
But in fact, he [00:05:00] was, uh, hanging out with his family and being inspired by some of the past, uh, experience that comes with, uh, leadership and decisions within a family structure. And what I thought would be really nice, Mike is to, you know, start from this very, very initial foundation. So this first clip.
Well, get here about with Satya. Introducing us to his family is all about talent being everywhere and opportunity. Not my great-grandfather who was a marginal farmer had just passed away, leaving my great grandmother, a young widow with two sons and no source of income to provide for our sons and their future.
She had to move to a town nearby and make some difficult choices. She became a domestic servant, but still could only afford to send one of her sons to school while the two boys were close in [00:06:00] age, both in grade school, one was seen as being more responsible while the other was a bit of a troublemaker migraine grandmother opted to send the more responsible diligence son.
Viewed as having more potential into the workforce, he became a day laborer at a construction site. He would continue knew in that field for the rest of his life. Never given the opportunity to gain new skills bills and gain higher level employment. The other son was sent to the local school and that boy was my grandfather.
Despite being seen as being less responsible, he continued through school and eventually became a police officer despite entering the workforce nearly a decade after his brother, his starting [00:07:00] salary was exponentially higher. It was my grandfather's education and the eventual carrier that enabled my father to pursue his own education.
Which eventually allowed me to follow my own passions. The opportunity my grandfather was given impacted the tragic trajectories of the generations to come. This personal story reflects that often repeated ad age talent is everywhere, but opportunity is not. Well, that ma that is a pretty heavy hitting over an in clip.
Holy smoke. Where, where are we going to stop with that one? I mean, what a great moving story. Also, what I appreciate is his acknowledgement to see the impact that. His grandfather had on his father and [00:08:00] subsequent the opportunities he brought, uh, to such a himself. So obviously full of gratitude and acknowledgement there.
That was very good. But let's, let's go into this talent is everywhere, but opportunity is not, I mean, where do we start on packing them? Well, I mean, for me, you've just touched on a couple of elements of clip that I really like around, um, gratitude. I thought it's a perfect way to start because it demonstrates.
His personal approach to leadership, his ability to think about people first to think about the foundation of his individuals, the Mike, as well as his customers. And this is going to be something that we're going to re really dig into in today, show his focus of Satya's. Um, but also it's, I think a really valuable lesson for us too, or be aware of, which is the identification.
And the acceptance of opportunities being that. So what's very, very easy, particularly in a, a [00:09:00] stressful job or a, a time perhaps like a 20, 20 or post 2020 year is to. Assume that you do not have, uh, everything figured out. We don't have an easy way of life things aren't handed to you on a patter. And what I think is a really, really great lesson that comes from this introduction clip is the acknowledgement that opportunity needs to be identified.
It needs to be celebrated and it needs to be grabbed when you can see it. You know, you, you shouldn't. Be so distracted that you don't identify it. Don't be so Jarrow that? Yeah. Don't put it down. I have gratitude for it. Yeah. So it's interesting. You said the word distracted. Uh, I would challenge that. I would say it's really awareness because when you take this anecdote of, [00:10:00] um, these two sons who one of which was, uh, such his grandfather, One of them just kind of went into a job and stayed there for his whole life.
The other who was perceived as having less potential, uh, who went to a supposedly perceived lesser school, um, sort of seize the day and made it an opportunity of, of life. And I think, um, it's the search. It's the awareness of the need to go out and find opportunity. It is the search for what's next and not just being sort of in that coma of just doing your thing and not challenging yourself, not asking yourself tough questions about who you want to be and where you want to go.
And I think it was a great clip, Mark. I mean, poof, a really. A really strong, um, set of [00:11:00] ideas are locked inside of this, but do you know what the best thing about this Mark is? This sort of is a very subtle, yet powerful nod to one of the core ideas that we can take away from such. Yeah. Now the way we're going to do the show today is we're going to have three really powerful ideas around our own personal performance.
And then we're going to jump into the wider world and look at leadership and look at community and the ways we can work within them. And that's all. Thanks. To such a, but to bring us back to where we just were Mark, if we're in the, uh, search of opportunity, cause you know, you can have talent, but you got to work on it.
Right? You got to go find opportunity. Mike, what I want to present to you as this next clip, because I think in here is perhaps one of the biggest things that we can all learn from Satya. So we synced in the story that such, it just told us that he's really orientating himself [00:12:00] towards some ideas around personal growth opportunity.
Uh, you can tell there's this underlying thriving DNA that he has, and here's the good news. We can all have it too. And it starts with this next idea, which is, uh, in the clip. We're going to play. From Satya Nadella, and it's all about a growth mindset. And I believe that everything that needs to be known about Microsoft in 2019 can be traced back to our origin, uh, which is rebuild technology so that others can build more technology.
Right. I felt like we were doing things out of when we and others, we needed to get back to what we, our core identity. That's right. Especially in 2019, where every company is a software company around the world, uh, we can just basically be a software platform and tools provider and have a good business.
And so I felt let's be proud of who we are. Of course, if you've got to express it [00:13:00] differently. Uh, and, and then, you know, it really reinforced that. That's why we talk about our mission around empowering people and organizations. The other piece though, Is we had to work on our culture. Uh, you know, I distinctly remember, I guess it was 98 when we first became, uh, the largest market cap company in the world.
Uh, And many of us, you know, we're lucky enough to participate on that wave of growth. Uh, but I remember that day when we walked around, you could see in the CA you know, on campus, people thought, wow, we must be God's gifts to mankind. Uh, right. We're so smart. We're so good. Look at us and, and accept that it was not the case.
I mean, the case was. Uh, you know, it's a temporal thing and it only matters what matters is your ability to learn, grow, be grounded in the realities and you know, and our customers and what have you. And so that's why I wanted a culture that [00:14:00] stood for that learning organization. And in fact, my wife had introduced me to a book by a Stanford professor, Carol Dweck, um, uh, which I'd read mine.
Many years before I became CEO, it was a huge influence in our household, uh, as it relates to our own children's education. But quite frankly, it was a great education for me because when I read that book, I realized that that that notion of growth mindset applies to individuals like me. It applies to companies like Microsoft.
So we took that meme of growth mindset and said, look, let's not be know-it-alls, let's be learn it alls and has been a very helpful. Uh, part of, I would say our journey around this, uh, what is a cultural meme that we can even make first class that we can have a real dialogue? God, Whoa. There's a lot of good stuff in that one, Mike.
Hmm, a lot, a lot of good stuff, obviously, such as calling out Carol Dweck's growth mindset book. And I know [00:15:00] that this is going to be a big thing as we start exploring such years leadership approach for me, I mean, learn, grow, be grounded. This is really when you do dig into such as approach and style from a leadership, as well as a personal development piece, he is really, really focused on this.
Learn it all approach, you know, he's got that passion that drive to, to learn, to adapt and to also listen and this growth mindset. It reminds me of a lot of the lessons that we learned from, um, you know, Patrick Lencioni about being a great team player. You've got to listen to others. You've got to absorb, uh, whoever's the smartest person in the room, perhaps make sure to.
Uh, adapt and, and surround yourself with these inspirational individuals. Um, but also this idea of being grounded, you know, they could have been on the campus thinking that they were the top [00:16:00] dogs or God's gifts as I think he says. Yeah. But having that, the, the, almost the patients, I suppose you could say the awareness, going back to what you were saying in that first clip, the awareness of, Hey, we can still get better.
Um, we can still help other people is really powerful and accurate. Yeah. It's this growth mindset is not to be underestimated, I think for you and any of our listeners right now, if you kind of want to like get to the essence of one of the most highest order principles that do. Define most of the moonshot is it is really a growth mindset.
These are people who are fundamentally willing to take feedback, to challenge themselves, to strive, to be better, to find a different way of doing something. They are curious. Open-minded they're excited [00:17:00] about the possibilities of learning new. Things. And I think the growth mindset, which really deserves its own show now that we, now that I think about, uh, the fact that we, that we haven't done a show on Carol Dweck's work, um, bad on us, but Hey, we're going to grow.
We're going to learn. We're going to be granted. I think that, um, at one, one peak, one part of that. Growth mindset. And, you know, there's obviously the desire to learn which we celebrate so much. I mean, we are learning out loud together in this very yeah. Show. So learning is, has been this constant topic.
And, uh, just as an exercise, if you think about Christine Lagarde, I mean, she is totally of a growth mindset. All right. She was backpacking around America. She was doing synchronized swimming during the teacher strike in, in Paris. I mean, she's totally open to the new and she's willing to try a different [00:18:00] thing.
Would you, would you agree? And I I'd take it one step further and say she had enough obstacles in the way that she could have given up. The obstacles of, of being in a, a kind of a all boys club, as well as being a president of a pretty technical, a couple of, couple of businesses to put it, to put it mildly, you know, there would have been a lot of those obstacles and within a fixed mindset with that kind of static intelligence and ability to change, that's an obstacle that would have.
Been a roadblock for some people, it was, you know, forced you down a path of an easier approach. Yes, exactly. You're right. Christine went down more of a growth mindset and she persisted, she persisted in the face of that setback. And made it work and that's a pure demonstration of a growth mindset. Isn't it?
But yeah. So for me, we've touched on, on the learning aspect. Um, another part of [00:19:00] it is the resilience aspect. So a growth mindset is like, I'm going to learn something new and I'm going to do the 10,000 hours. I am prepared to work at it. So I think those are the, some of the cornerstones, but actually I think.
The, the interesting thing that he alluded to, but I'd, I'd love to dive into is how you unlock, um, this growth mindset. And I think it starts with questioning and challenging your self. And, um, you know, the, the exercise here is I want to tackle the awareness thing because what I've found in my personal experience, Is that I had to go through a whole series of events in my life that led me to being more sort of leaning towards this growth mindset.
And so I'm thinking about this. Like if we could, uh, propel some of our, [00:20:00] uh, listeners to propel ourselves further into a growth mindset, I think it all comes down to how you question your, your situation and. You know, what I would do is ask questions about around, um, are you doing things that you feel that you're naturally designed to do?
Um, are you challenging yourself to do things. In a different way. Um, I'm really, um, interested in the unlock. Um, are you facing a problem? Uh, that is really hard to fix and requires a totally different approach. Um, Asking yourself. How good does it feel when you learn something? Um, how you can really, uh, sort of unlock the curiosity engine?
Because I think if you're prepared to ask [00:21:00] yourself tough questions, if you're prepared to ask yourself and challenge yourself, then I think you can sort of. Kickstart this growth mindset, this growth engine, the curiosity engine. And then, then you're completely willing to try different things. Is this really my best work?
Can I do better? Uh, and because you're kind of glowing in this curiosity and this growth you're prepared to spend. The time to go out and learn and to go out and grow yourself as a whole person to be the best version of yourself, even if you're only making a 1% difference every day or every week. The fact that you're so curious that you're celebrating the growth to me, this is the, the, the really big unlock.
And so I think, you know, we listened to such a, and it's all great that he's got this growth mindset and he's transformed the company, but not all of us are ready. So I think what's interesting, Mark is [00:22:00] how, how do you think we can get ready for growth mindset? If you wanted to really challenge yourself about having a growth mindset right now, what questions would you ask yourself, man?
I mean, it's such a hugely, uh, relevant question, Mike, because I often find myself at this crossroad myself, you know, when there are challenges or obstacles, uh, It is very, very tempting to, to, you know, almost lean on them and say, Oh, well, that's kind of it then. Okay. Nevermind. I gave it a go, I'll go. And I'll go and give up now.
And what I found through the Ron holiday series was trying to adapt and think of those obstacles as opportunities. That was very helpful for me, but what I'm, uh, where I'm getting inspired by the moonshot is that we will be, uh, cover. Is that each of them had, as we were saying earlier, has something else to, to teach us and what I'm [00:23:00] hearing from Satya and how he's, um, you know, really projecting an awareness of the growth mindset onto our agendas.
I'm reminded that there's also within the fixed versus growth mindset, the idea of effort. So the idea of effort in a fixed mindset is efforts fruitless. Uh, I'm never going to get anywhere. And that's kind of it I've done my best. I'll see you later. Whereas on the growth mindset, the effort that you put into something, you mentioned the 10,000 hours, the effort that you put into something is your path to mastery.
And that's something that I, I think I haven't dug into enough, uh, in the past, you know, I think it's very easy for myself or listeners to fall into a pattern. Of okay. I've I've failed here. Well, maybe it's just not for me or this is too hard. I'm putting too much time in it. I'm not interested anymore.
And instead, [00:24:00] trying to, what I'm trying to do myself is retrain my reactions so that when I. Um, uh, perhaps dealing with something that hasn't quite worked instead of thinking, ah, well that was a pain, uh, nevermind. Almost celebrating it and thinking, well, that was a good opportunity to learn from. I can use that as a, uh, an opportunity to improve my effort for next time.
And gradually I'm getting better and better at this by the time this happens again. Hey, I'll know how to react. Yeah. Well, you know, Building on, um, getting comfortable on all of this. It's so much been a theme of the moonshots podcast that you have to embrace the discomfort, right? Failure is an opportunity to learn, to grow problems or opportunity with these really big things.
And what's it interesting is then you can see just like Zaha Hadid. She's like challenge has helped me grow. I become [00:25:00] better because of those challenges you can, um, Train yourself to be open to constructive feedback. You can take inspiration for others. And I think at the heart of this is really saying, um, when was the last time I tried something new?
I think if there was one behavior I could recommend to you, Mark. Just try new things. I think this opens up, it's like somewhere deep in your brain lights, turn on, uh, you know, neurons start buzzing when you do new things. Now, sometimes you can fall victim to feeling overwhelmed by these new things. But if you go in with a certain childlike mind and curiosity and say, Hey, let's just see how we go.
I think this is where the growth really can start. So for you, Mark, if I challenge you and said, okay, it's all about learning new things. What's the next new thing you would like to learn? I [00:26:00] think the next new thing I would like to learn is probably, you know, we've talked about it a few times in the show, but the patients to check my reaction.
And have it a little bit more controlled, you know, it's very easy to react and, you know, want to throw your hands up and say, well, that that's that then. And you know, you and I have talked about, uh, breathing exercises, maybe even going for a walk before you have to respond to something or someone. And that's a really handy one, I think.
As a growth opportunity for me and trying something new, that kind of feels like it. Yeah. Would be the most useful, I think. But at the same time, I've got a second one. Yeah. I've got a second one that actually might be even more valuable [00:27:00] expression. Maybe this is what, I'm, what I'm trying to communicate, you know, the expression of, okay, well, this is how I am feeling because of that difficulty.
So. Right. I've received it. Okay. Yes, I can practice patients, but actually what I should really do is express why or explore why we'll have the awareness to reflect and think, Oh, this is why I'm reacting. How can I grow from here? Well, yeah, that's, it's so interesting that you mentioned that because it's all about being in control of how you perceive the world and how you react to the world.
Right. Exactly. It's how you exactly. It's the awareness. It's the, the, the noticing now the great thing that you shared that Mark is that in our next series, which is going to be the timeless classics, we're going to go to Dale Carnegie, Stephen Covey, and air Carto of which to move those guys, their work deal [00:28:00] specifically, how you can be present, how you can be in control of the way you perceive the world, the way you react to it, because listen, Everyone right now, listening to the show, listening to you share that, which was really, really just perfect because I think we all have had to come to terms with that over the last year or two.
This is the secret to going out and doing something new. It is going to get a bit. Uh, wobbly, challenging, uh, unexpected things. Things won't go as planned and getting comfortable, uh, with the unexpected, uh, embracing the discomfort itself is an essential thing to doing great things in the world to having impact.
Cause it ain't easy. So to thread this all together, what we are learning from such is that this growth mindset is. Paramount, because in that you are constantly learning you're you're [00:29:00] saying, Hey, challenges, help me grow. This is a feedback. Great. Didn't do it. Well, no problem. I can do it better today. So this is really good staff.
We are getting into the really core stuff, the stuff that goes on in our minds and our bodies. As we go on to, to, to do the things that are daring that are bold and ambitious and such, uh, is paving the way. And the next thought he's got for us is really focusing. On your own behaviors. So the mindset is if you will, that's of the things we think, uh, and how we perceive the events.
Well, look at this, this next clip from such a Nadella is all about how we lead. By example, you want to set this culture of a growth mindset, where people can take risks and make mistakes and learn from them. And you want to walk the walk, the walk, um, when have you [00:30:00] had to lead by example on this front?
Well, I mean, every day I would say, but, you know, in some sense, the, the decision ones makes, um, in, uh, for me, the ability to sort of take, even take diversity and inclusion, uh, the. Saying the word saying we're going to make progress, uh, is one thing one then to recognize that progress has to be something that really has to come from one's own first change in behavior.
Right. Um, and. Take the everyday experience of the senior leadership team, the meeting itself. Uh, it's an interesting thing. Every time I questioned myself on everything that we talk about. As what we espouse that is more broadly applicable across the company. How much of it is represented in the behaviors?
[00:31:00] Starting with me of our own senior leadership team. We have some very, very, uh, amazing woman who are part of our leadership team. Uh, Are they participating, um, like anybody else. And in fact, I'm I allowing for them to be able to really make sure that we are listening to them. They are able to feel like they're driving the company and, and starting with that type of sensibility, which by the way is not constant, but at least I'll be pushing is the way I think I, you know, I remind myself of how important and to your point about it sort of putting it everyday practice.
Uh, we have three things that are the cultural, uh, I would say pillars for us, right? One is diversity and inclusion. The other one is customer obsession. And then the other one is to bring the company together as one company, as opposed to, you know, fragmented set of P and L all three of these are just super hard, uh, easy to say, uh, but require [00:32:00] everyday practice starting with me.
Easy to say, but requires everyday practice. I mean, Mike, if there was ever somebody who has challenged the work and the lessons that we do on moonshots, it's a tire. You know, we come here and every episode we do talk about progress and personal development. And I think exactly what he's saying here is, well, if you're not actually following through with it, putting into practice and giving it a go.
It's not the same. It's not the same as intention is it? It's gotta be behavior. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you, you can't just talk the talk. You've got to walk the walk as well. And, um, you know, As you will know, Mike, this is one of the things that really bothers me about Peter people who post a lot of, uh, virtue based content in social media.
And like, come on, guys, just do it. Not everything is a social media post. And it, what, [00:33:00] what really bothers me is that the unawareness that people have that they think. They are doing the right thing by talking about it in social media and not actually doing it. So this social outrage about this or that online, that's not changing the problem.
What I love about such a is it's like these topics, diversity inclusion, et cetera, they're hard. And I love the way he is. Like, it's got a follow through. With behavior and much like we did with the growth mindset. I think that all comes by asking tough questions to self evaluate. Uh, so I love to, uh, I've got quite a few different, uh, sets of questions that I use to call myself out.
So to avoid, um, You know, [00:34:00] getting in your own fantasy, you tell your own yourself, your own narrative. I think it's really important to ask yourself these questions and to force upon yourself some self evaluation. Now, obviously we actually did a bunch of questions on growth mindset. So we won't do a whole bunch here, but I think you have to be in a place where you can call yourself out.
So you don't fall into the trap of just talking the talk, but walking. The walk. So, Mark, how do you, how do you keep yourself honest with this idea of, you know, you can talk the talk, but how do you walk the walk? How do you follow through with things that you do? I do have some mantras as well. I do have a, a list of, um, guiding principles, I suppose you could call them that helped me check my reactions.
And this is very focused on. What mindset have I got right now? And how am I reacting [00:35:00] to things? I think what also helps me from a practical perspective is prior to going into a, uh, experience that might require, let's say a difficult conversation, I'll try and prepare things in advance. Not necessarily.
You know, a script. If it's, if, if I'm using a conversation as a, as an example, if I'm trying to stay true to my intended behavior, I'll try and plan it a little bit. So we've talked about why papers, one pages, skeleton structures that we will give, um, one another for our colleagues in order to align a little bit prior to, you know, doing the heavy lifting.
But I think the same is true when I'm preparing myself for a customer job, or even if it's just [00:36:00] something that I'm doing myself, I'll try to prepare a little bit. And that normally comes through, uh, notes or, uh, scribbles on, on a piece of paper or an iPad, just, just to help me prepare, because then the benefit that I find with that is I can almost anticipate my own reaction.
So if I already know how I'm going to react to something, it allows me to recognize it, have the awareness and check it prior to, you know, what you're really seeing is, um, you know, probably the answer to the question. Did I spend enough time to do quality work? Exactly. It's noticing that. And that's really a story of preparation, right?
So there's some other great self-evaluation questions. If you want to call yourself out, did I work as hard as I could have? Did I maintain the standards I have set for myself? Did I ask for help? When help was needed. Did I use the [00:37:00] resources around me? Um, there's a number of great, uh, growth mindset questions you can challenge yourself with.
Um, and you can, you can really use those in a journaling form or in conversation with others to call yourself out. So you can. Not only talk the talk, but walk the walk and everything that we've discussed today really brings us to this point in time where we have to be at our best every single day. And, uh, you know, with Tom Brady, we saw lots of conditions that he sets to be the best.
It can be on the field. Very much about preparation to your point. Mark is holistic mind, body, spirit. He's really pulling it all together. Basis is all about thinking and doing, and particularly the mental models that have unlocks these crazy flywheel effects. And with Christine Nygaard, someone who is just insanely curious and collaborative, but what we've got in store now is another thought from [00:38:00] Satya Nadella that really kind of brings us home.
And what we're going to hear now is. How he responded to a challenge. So everything we've talked about, like how we receive a message and how our actions come out of it. This clip that we're about to hear is all about such a being of a growth mindset. Before you were CEO, you took this job leading Microsoft's first real cloud business.
And Steve bomber apparently told you this might be your last job at Microsoft, because if you fail, there's no parachute. That feels like a lot of pressure. Why did you make that jump? You know, um, you know, Steve who went to school here, Um, had many, he just went for one year from what I understand. Oh, this is the funniest thing I should tell that said there's.
I mean, I guess the other guy who went to school here was Mukesh Ambani. So I believe one day, uh, uh, Steve bomber was introducing Mukesh in Bombay. [00:39:00] Um, and, uh, he joked that both of us dropped out of GSB, except that Mukesh had never told anybody that he had dropped out of GSB. So there was a real scandal.
And, uh, so Steve, uh, You know, wanted us to really take this new business area, which is our online business. Um, in fact, Susan who was here and I worked on it, uh, for a long time as well. And he felt that look, this was a place where we needed to make progress. And, uh, Steve had this very, uh, Clear sense. So what it means to succeed and his point was you're going to go learn a lot.
Uh, and, uh, of course I'll fire you if you don't do a good job with it. Uh, and it is sort of a way for him to perhaps communicate both why he is the CEO cared about this business, uh, and at the same time, his expectations. Uh, but I must say that [00:40:00] particular tour of duty. It has been the most influential in how, uh, I've sort of thought about whether it's distributed computing at its core, whether it's the economic models, uh, that are going to be emergent.
Uh, and that has been very, very helpful doing different things inside the company, uh, has helped me grow. To run the company eventually. So, you know, I actually appreciate Steve, both giving me that opportunity and more importantly, giving me the message, uh, that look at the end of the day it's performance.
That matters. Uh, very good. Um, what's, what's fun or, uh, perhaps revealing about a particular clip. Again, it's a demonstration of a growth mindset, Mike, because he calls out this idea of expectations from others. And perhaps even the idea of criticism, you know, receiving feedback and learning from it is, is another [00:41:00] element of a growth mindset.
Isn't it? And, and this is a great call-out from Satya where he was given one himself and then helped him drive for success. Mark, just to hear the sort of. The laughter and the smile that he has when Steve, Bohmer not the most subtle of people tells him this is probably going to be your last job. And he's like giggling at the, the delight of it and was willing to take it on.
No problem. I just want you to imagine you and all our listeners. That somebody comes to you, your boss and says, Hey, I got a new job for you. It's really tough. It's really potent. And you'll probably stuff it up and we'll probably fire you with most of it. This would go into cardiac arrest. Yeah, because it, this is the growth mindset again, he's like, okay, well obviously this matters.
So if it's a big deal, maybe I can really help the company by taking on this challenge. And Mark, this is just the perfect way to [00:42:00] surmise what we can learn from Satya, for ourselves, for our individual performance. I think this, this is growth mindset. Like inaction one, this curiosity and willingness to take on new things to leading by example, he's prepared to walk the walk and three is like adversity challenge.
No problem. I mean, this to me is like a great body of learning from which we can take from Satya and embed it into our daily practice. Ask the tough questions. Pause be grounded before you respond. I mean, what a great first start to first half of the show, Mark. I mean, this is really good and I'm not sure that we've actually had someone really exposed us to growth mindset like this.
Can you remember anyone that's really done that? I mean, we've certainly disgusted ourselves. We've certainly made some comparisons with the moonshot as we've covered. And how we might [00:43:00] use a moon, uh, growth mindset approach ourselves. But I don't think we've really specified it as. Clear as, as it has been today coming from Satya.
I, I feel as though you're right. We've got to do, we've got to do a, another session on growth mindset and we, yeah, the book by Carol Dweck, where, where right through the, the, the biggest chunk of the show we've learnt so much. And I tell you what, there is a destination. On the internet, which can fuel your growth mindset.
Where would that be more well for those who want to dig into, um, potentially a back catalog, maybe go and hear these episodes that we've referred to such as Christine Lagarde, Jeff Bezos. Tom Brady. Uh, I did. I think you've referenced lady Gaga earlier as well. You can pop over to www.moonshotsand.io. And over there, you'll see all 118 [00:44:00] episodes.
Once this one goes live, you've got transcripts for all of the shows, some additional show notes, as well as documentation's got mantras, you've got an ability to sign up for our newsletter, but also Mike. Our listeners have the opportunity to leave us feedback. Who would they like to hear from and who inspires them day to day?
And this is where we've got a lot of our direction. In fact, patina from Munich recommended. We covered. So Tina, thank you very much for that. We hope you enjoyed the episode and as we grow our listenership, Mike, I hope we're going to continue getting lots of good recommendations. From our listeners. I totally am signing up for that.
And to encourage all of you to hit moonshots.io, tell us what you think of the show, who you want us to cover. And if you are listening in wonderful a podcasting app right now, if you've got a moment, we would really appreciate a rating, a review, [00:45:00] uh, share this with a friend that you think might benefit from a little bit of a turbo boost on their growth mindset, because that's how.
By sharing the show. That's how people find out about the show. That's how we grow. That's how we have the opportunity to share with you all the lessons that we can learn by. Learning out loud together. Now talking about learning and talking about how to embed this into how we work. Now, we have a couple more clips with a lot of goodness in them.
Where should we start the next couple of episodes? Next couple of clips we've got from satire are now reflecting back on leadership. Mike, either the pillars, the foundations that really have driven him in his roles within Microsoft. Cause remember. He's been CEO since 2014, but he's also been in the business for far, far longer.
And what's interesting is these lessons that he's learned along the way. So this first clip we're going to hear in this batch of lessons on leadership [00:46:00] is going to be how empathy is a path to success. And we were the only children of our parents. So the, when we both laid in our late twenties, when our first son was about to be born, we were very excited.
The household was all about, you know, um, my wife's an architect and so she was practicing at that time. And so my only concern was all, when will undo go back to school? I would have to go back to, uh, work. And how are we going to think about the baby's daycare and what have you, uh, and lo and behold, uh, one night, um, Uh, you know, there was some complications and, uh, our son Zane was born, uh, because of, uh, some complications.
He now has a cerebral palsy. He's uh, he got as he has quadriplegia and, uh, is locked in. And I would say for the first. Maybe as many as five years, I struggled with it. Um, primarily because I felt that all these plans that I had for what our [00:47:00] life was going to be like, um, had taken a real turn and, uh, and then I watched ANU go up and down.
Five 20 in Seattle taking him to every therapy, possible speech, occupational. Uh, and then I was just watching it and still moaning, uh, my own sort of whatever, uh, issues. But then it dawned on me, uh, that nothing actually happened to me. Uh, something had happened to my son and that I needed to as a father step up and do my duty.
In other words, it is the harsh, but real lesson around being able to see the world through the eyes of my son. Right. That's what empathy is all about. Um, and, and I think that's what it is. I mean, it's, it's innate in us all as humans. Uh, I think empathy is something that we are all very capable of. Uh, life teaches us that, uh, and in small ways and in, in, in tough ways, like I remember even the [00:48:00] foot, the last interview by the last interview or when I was interviewing at Microsoft was also a life-changing moment for me.
Uh, so I went through this interview. It was all caught on screen at that time. And, you know, and so this guy sort of says, Hey, here's a question for you. You're at the crossroads, a baby falls. And is crying. What do you do? And I say, wow, this is some search algorithm I didn't learn, uh, is, must be some variant of some traveling salesman problem or something.
And I sort of really thought about it for a few minutes in that I said, I'll go to the phone booth and call nine one, one. This was pre smartphone. Um, and, uh, so he gets up, he escorts me out and he says, you know what? You need. To develop some empathy because when a baby falls, you pick them up and hug them first before you call.
Uh, and I thought, that's it. I'm not, I'm definitely not going to get this job. Um, and. [00:49:00] And, and lo and behold, I did get the job, but nevertheless, I mean, I, I really think that that's so core and some people say, well, like what, what does that have to do with sort of business? Or what does it have to do with, uh, work?
And I believe it has everything to do with work. You know, I believe if you sort of say innovation is all about meeting unmet unarticulated needs of customers, where does that source of your ability. To get in touch with that unmet unarticulated need going to come from. It's going to come from your ability to, in some sense, be able to listen between the lines are to be able to extrapolate, uh, and that's to me, deep sense of empathy, right?
So people talk about design thinking. I think design thinking is empathy. Uh, and so therefore I do believe that, you know, life teaches you empathy and empathy is the source to success in any innovative, uh, agenda you have. Oh, he just touched on a bunch of themes that are right up my alley, Mark. [00:50:00] Holy smoke.
Um, okay. First of all, I love that he understands the relationship between empathy, design thinking and innovation, because. What's really interesting on a tactical level here. If you do want to create something new, you have to understand what people need in order to do that. You have to demonstrate some empathy and a theme that he comes back to time and time again is walking in the shoes of others.
And I would say, Mark, this doesn't only help you build. A great product for your customers. I think this really helps you take care of your colleagues and your teammates too. Wouldn't you think? Yeah. I mean, if you can't imagine the situation that your colleagues or teammates are going through, then you're probably going to give them feedback or a request or a bit of work.
That's pretty unreasonable. You know, I think it's, you know, you'd want to talk to your family. [00:51:00] In a pleasant way, don't you, you don't want to upset your sister or your, your parents or whatever it might be. And I believe a similar approach is necessary with work. If you can understand and appreciate where a colleague or customer is coming from, then you're more likely to be able to a spend your time doing something valuable.
And be not upset everybody in the process. It's really, really powerful. Empathy is very undervalued. Um, in, uh, the internal dynamics within an organization it's often a bit too doggy dog kind of thing. The, uh, the interesting thing here is that, you know, companies might spend a lot of money trying to understand their customers, but there's a really interesting insight.
How much money do they spend understanding their employees? Yeah. And it's a real, once you actually kind of unpack that one, you're like, Oh gosh. And I think what [00:52:00] Sattia is highlighting for us is the need to, to show him empathy through all those different stakeholders and communities, if you really want to get the most out of them.
And I think he's results speak for themselves. So I don't need to, to convince anyone that he's got the points on the scoreboard, as far as that's concerned. But talking about school boards, might we actually have the opportunity to dive in and talk a little bit of sport, uh, through Satya Nadella because he had the most, uh, amazing experience.
Something that if you want to see empathy to your teammates, this is coming up in this clip. What we're going to hear now is a story of such a playing cricket, something that happened to him, which was really very demonstratively of what. Leadership looks like another foundational influence for you with sports.
Now, my fellow international classmates and I were mystified daily by American sports references. So we're very [00:53:00] happy to talk about cricket. Yeah. You love cricket and you dreamt of playing professionally. What lessons did you take from the pitch? Well, I mean, um, you know, all of us who are South Asian are obsessed to it, that sport and, um, you know, it's sort of, uh, in fact, that's right.
I mean, that was what I was pretty much all bound up in all through my, uh, high school into college. Um, and. You know, when I look back, you know, I think all sport teaches you a lot. Uh, and especially at least I feel team sport, uh, I think has a huge impact in how you think about, uh, leadership. Uh, I'll never forget this one particular, uh, incident that I think subsequently written about.
Uh, there was this guy who was my school captain who went on to do pretty good. Well, uh, in, in the context of Indian cricket, uh, I was bowling trash that day. Uh, and he took over [00:54:00] from me, got a wicked, which is a breakthrough. Uh, but then he gave me the ball back and then I went on to have perhaps the best bullying spell I've ever had in my life.
Um, and I always reflected as to why he lead. He'd do that. And then, uh, in fact, much less Ron in life, I went back and asked to meet with, uh, and so at least the way I surmised it as a leadership decision, he made. Or saying, look, I recognize that this guy is, he had recognized the importance of not breaking my confidence.
Uh, and I said, look, what, that's a pretty enlightened decision for a high school leader, you know, captain of a cricket team to make, uh, and a lot of leadership lessons is that right, which is you've got to make hard calls on safe performance, but also you gotta be able to sort of understand that you need your team, and it's not like everybody's going to have a good day all the time and that subtle distinction, uh, and that judgment, right.
Which is one of the things that I feel. Which is the most understated part of leadership [00:55:00] is judgment. Uh, and it's so important. And that judgment comes by you exercising this muscle around passing judgment, uh, and learning from it. And I thought that's one of the lessons I learned. He was building a confidence in a way by making judgment, being key and coming from passing judgment.
I mean, that's something to dig into Mike, but before we do the. The recognition of not breaking your, your teammates or your colleagues, confidence. I mean, that, that story, like you say, is, is a wonderful little narrative from Satya. And I can understand and take something from that, which is when a colleague or an individual that you're collaborating with gives you that an opportunity much like some of the other clips we've heard today, make the most of it.
Be inspired by it. Do your best work every day, no matter what that, that opportunity or that [00:56:00] moment comes through. Um, but also, I, I love the idea that. It's lasted with him throughout the rest of his career from high school, he's still talking about, which shows you what happens when you use that empathy and you, you share your confidence with others to help them.
Become confident, like the fact that to give it an American equivalent, that would be like a pitcher comes on, does really poorly. They take him off. The next guy comes in, gets a few strikes. Um, but then walks off, gives the ball back to the one that was struggling. He comes back on the mat and then starts throwing again.
That's the, essentially the story he told, but through it through a cricket game, this was really powerful because the. The guy who replaced Satya was aware that it was more about helping such a rise rather than in [00:57:00] him being the star of the game. And we've seen this big time when Michael Jordan had to learn to pass, we saw this a lot with, uh, Tom Brady and the impact he has on those around him.
This is really the highest form of leadership. It's not just about your individual performance. It is about. The team it's bringing everyone along with you. And I think this is on the second side of the growth mindset using this empathy to boost those around you. What a great big lesson that we're getting from such a here, Mark.
Yeah, this is so powerful when we consider how we can all be not only great leaders, but also great team mates and team players. Once we can focus on that empathy, once we can think about the confidence that we have, as well as the judgment we give to others, I mean, you're really creating the best environment and ecosystem for collaboration [00:58:00] as well as communication to thrive.
You are, you are, you're actually bringing everything together and such is going to do that for us now, because he's going to bring everything together. This thinking that he has shared with us over the last hour, he's going to bring it together in this last clip, which is really all about how you work with others.
What advice would this Satya Nadella give that Satya Nadella seven years ago? I mean, The thing that perhaps was the steepest learning curve for me as CEO was understanding, what does it mean to have multiple constituents? Uh, right. I mean, people talk about, or it's about customers. It's about employees.
It's about investors. It's about other stakeholders. And today of course, a multi-stakeholder capitalism is the topic that everybody's talking about. But understanding what as a CEO, what does that mean? How do you really grapple with it? And it can't be something that I'll divide my [00:59:00] week into multiple stakeholders, right?
In equal quantities. It's about harmonizing that into the core of your business model, as well as your operations, as a business. Uh, that's probably been the thing that I would say having a framework for it. I feel fantastic about the work. The entire team at Microsoft has done around it. Right. Uh, because you need to have a business model fundamentally, where when you do well, the world around you is doing well.
If that is broken, it's very hard to fix. Uh, even if you have business performance, but if the world around you, because of your business, performance is not doing well, that's a social contract that you cannot be put back together. So I would say that's the advice I would give any CEO is to ask. And I know it's something that it's also gotta be managed every day.
It's not something you take for granted. Another final closing, practical tip from satire to bring it all around for us. Mike, the [01:00:00] idea of creating frameworks, as well as again, that daily ritual of, of checking in, of doing the best work that you can. And always maintaining this harmonization and collaboration with teammates.
I mean, that's, that's, that's a full package right there. It certainly is. Isn't it. And it's, um, it's really fascinating how he understands this model that, you know, if you, the individual is doing well, then your constituents, your teammates, your clients, everyone. Has to kind of get the net positive effect.
And that's how you can judge, if you're doing the right thing. I mean, wow. Some really good stuff. And, and w what, what an actual, uh, what a joy it is to dig into someone that's come into an organization and had so much positive. Effect. I mean, the transformation is clear. What we've been able to do is unpack what did [01:01:00] he do in order to get such a great result, uh, for the team at Microsoft.
And boy, he brought some unique flavors, which, which is the long lasting flavor for Huma, which thought do you take away? The strongest I've always had. A desire to dig in deep into the, the empathy piece. And I know some of our other men's shelters have as well as our other leaders that we've covered in this series are our customer as well as employee focused.
But I mean, Mike, we've got to, we've got to revisit growth mindset. We have to do the Carol Dweck book. Don't we, it's pretty powerful stuff. Isn't it? Yeah. We've got to do it. I mean, we can clearly learn so much, um, practical tips there around our, our. Emotional mindsets as well as our physical reactions to things.
So I think that's got to be such as recommendation or having a growth mindset has to be the one. Totally totally well, Mark, [01:02:00] thank you to you for helping me discover to learn, uh, and get a bit more deeper into the growth mindset. And thank you to you. All of the moonshot is who are literally in all four corners of the planet.
I mean, we were talking recently about, uh, you know, Lithuania and Bulgaria and all the new listeners that have joined us. From those countries. Well, Estonia has said are wearing here too. So it's wonderful to welcome all our listeners from Astonia, uh, the Philippines as well. Um, it is so, so wonderful to see people really from all four corners of the planet, learning out loud together, all of us, trying to be the very best version of ourselves and boy today, did we get a dose of self.
Improvement with Satya Nadella, the CEO of Microsoft, this man's impact cannot be understated. He has shifted a [01:03:00] company that was struggling, uh, certainly not on fire to becoming a powerhouse in the cloud. If you want to measure that impact. When he joined the company was valued at 300 billion, it is now worth 1.75 trillion.
So, how did he do that? Well, it was a month mindset. It was a growth mindset. And that starts with embracing something new. This starts with leading by example. If you want to talk the talk, you need to walk the walk and talking about walking. It's all about walking in the shoes of others, because empathy is what it takes to unlock the potential.
Uh, or if the people around you and when you're feeling confident, what is so damn important is that you give your confidence to others that you run. I's the tide for them. So all the boats can sail, and this will result in you finding [01:04:00] harmony within yourself to be confident, to be the best version of yourself, but you will also find harmony for those.
Around you as well. And if you do that well, one thing for sure, you can make sure that the world around you does well as well. All right. That was such an Adela and this is the moonshots podcast. That's a wrap.